How can the movie Moneyball claim that the Red Sox used the Billy Beane A’s method to win the world series

The movie Moneyball is b.s the Red Sox’ player payroll was the second highest player payroll in the league in 2004 when the Red Sox won the first W.S in a long time.Even though Boston wasn’t anywhere close to the Yankees’ payroll in 2004, which was $182,835,513 ($6,304,673 average salary), it still outspent the next closest team, the Anaheim Angels ($101,084,667 payroll in 2004) by almost $25 million.

The truth of the matter is that, had the Red Sox not traded for high profile, high salary players like Pedro Martinez, Manny Ramirez, David Ortiz, and Curt Schilling, they would not have won the World Series in 2004. It takes talent to win in any sport, especially on baseball’s highest stage. If Theo didn’t spend the money and buy the player, the Red Sox wouldn’t have the championship. So, in short, Theo and the Red Sox bought a championship that year.

hollywood aren’t the smartest of people

I agree there. But they did it to get publicity because i don’t think some national sports writers know that Baseball even exists west of New York. But the Minnesota Twins would be a better example, Florida Marlins in the late 90s and early 2000s would be another good example than what they used

It had nothing to do with the Red Sox payroll.
They used the same ideas that Billy Beane used, paying more attention to OBP than AVG, using sabremetrics ect.
The Red Sox had more money, which allowed them to get all the players they wanted.
They also were not in as much fear of losing players as Oakland was over players such as Jason Giambi. If you recall, the A’s really wanted to keep Giambi, but couldn’t afford him.
The Sox could resign all their players.
Epstein built a team with Beanes system.
Since he had money, it allowed them to get any player they want, and win a championship.

Beane used different methods than were common at the time. In doing so, he was able to “exploit marker inefficiencies” and far more useful talent for a particular amount of money.

Beane found it useful because he didn’t have much money with which to work.

The Red Sox, with Bill James, were using similar player evaluation techniques. Since they had more money, they ended up with a better team.

With most teams now embracing those techniques, those teams with more money are again at an advantage. The new market inefficiencies must be found elsewhere. Foreign players from non-traditional locales is one of these.

Just because you see something in a movie doesn’t make it true. Most if not all of the time filmmakers like to use what they call “artistic license” to change facts to tell a more entertaining story.

I just want to point out that David Ortiz was NOT a high profile player when the Red Sox signed him. He’d only played two full seasons at that point, and had never hit more than 20 home runs.
According to Baseball-Reference.com, the most similar player to David Ortiz when the Red Sox signed him was… Nick Johnson.
No joke.

It’s a movie. They can claim anything they want. Their job is to entertain, not report facts.

Look at this list of Top 100 players right now. Who do you think is player #101

100. Ichiro Suzuki RF Seattle Mariners
99. Carl Crawford LF Boston Red Sox
98. Stephen Strasburg SP Washington Nationals
97. Starlin Castro SS Chicago Cubs
96. Chase Utley 2B Philadelphia Phillies
95. Michael Morse 1B/LF Washington Nationals
94. Michael Bourn CF Atlanta Braves
93. Craig Kimbrel CL Atlanta Braves
92. Ryan Madson CL Cincinnati Reds
91. Shin-Soo Choo RF Cleveland Indians
90. Madison Bumgarner SP San Francisco Giants
89. Adam Wainwright SP St. Louis Cardinals
88. Gio Gonzalez SP Washington Nationals
87. Kevin Youkilis 3B Boston Red Sox
86. Alex Rodriguez 3B New York Yankees
85. Howard Kendrick 2B Los Angeles Angels of Anaheim
84. Dan Uggla 2B Atlanta Braves
83. Rickie Weeks 2B Milwaukee Brewers
82. Carlos Beltran OF St. Louis Cardinals
81. Ben Zobrist 2B/OF Tampa Bay Rays
80. Joe Mauer C Minnesota Twins
79. Carlos Santana C Cleveland Indians
78. Heath Bell CL Miami Marlins
77. John Axford CL -Milwaukee Brewers
76. Brian Wilson CL San Francisco Giants
75. Jhonny Peralta SS Detroit Tigers
74. Brett Lawrie 3B Toronto Blue Jays
73. Eric Hosmer 1B Kansas City Royals
72. Yovani Gallardo SP Milwaukee Brewers
71. Tim Hudson SP Atlanta Braves
70. Adam Jones CF Baltimore Orioles
69. Alex Gordon LF Kansas City Royals
68. Cole Hamels SP Philadelphia Phillies
67. David Freese 3B St. Louis Cardinals
66. Aramis Ramirez 3B Milwaukee Brewers
65. Ricky Romero SP Toronto Blue Jays
64. Zack Greinke SP Milwaukee Brewers
63. David Price SP Tampa Bay Rays
62. Jose Valverde CL Detroit Tigers
61. Jonathan Papelbon CL Philadelphia Phillies
60. Buster Posey C San Francisco Giants
59. Ryan Howard 1B Philadelphia Phillies
58. Shane Victorino CF Philadelphia Phillies
57. Josh Beckett SP Boston Red Sox
56. Chris Carpenter SP St. Louis Cardinals
55. Mark Teixeira 1B New York Yankees
54. Carlos Gonzalez OF Colorado Rockies
53. David Ortiz DH Boston Red Sox
52. Derek Jeter SS New York Yankees
51. Lance Berkman 1B St. Louis Cardinals
50. Jon Lester SP Boston Red Sox
49. Ian Kennedy SP Arizona Diamondbacks
48. Miguel Montero C Arizona Diamondbacks
47. Brian McCann C Atlanta Braves
46. Matt Cain SP San Francisco Giants
45. James Shields SP Tampa Bay Rays
44. Pablo Sandoval 3B San Francisco Giants
43. Matt Holliday LF St. Louis Cardinals
42. Andrew McCutchen CF Pittsburgh Pirates
41. Giancarlo Mike Stanton RF Miami Marlins
40. Brandon Phillips 2B Cincinnati Reds
39. Alex Avila C Detroit Tigers
38. Yadier Molina C St. Louis Cardinals
37. Dan Haren SP – Los Angeles Angels of Anaheim
36. Hunter Pence RF Philadelphia Phillies
35. Nelson Cruz RF Texas Rangers
34. Mike Napoli C Texas Rangers
33. Paul Konerko 1B Chicago White Sox
32. Asdrubal Cabrera SS Cleveland Indians
31. Ian Kinsler 2B Texas Rangers
30. Josh Hamilton LF Texas Rangers
29. Michael Young UTIL Texas Rangers
28. Justin Upton RF Arizona Diamondbacks
27. Mariano Rivera CL New York Yankees
26. CC Sabathia SP New York Yankees
25. Jose Reyes SS Miami Marlins
24. Hanley Ramirez 3B Miami Marlins
23. Curtis Granderson CF New York Yankees
22. Ryan Zimmerman 3B Washington Nationals
21. Evan Longoria 3B Tampa Bay Rays
20. Felix Hernandez SP Seattle Mariners
19. Tim Lincecum SP San Francisco Giants
18. Cliff Lee SP Philadelphia Phillies
17. Jacoby Ellsbury CF Boston Red Sox
16. Adrian Beltre 3B Texas Rangers
15. Joey Votto 1B Cincinnati Reds
14. Adrian Gonzalez 1B Boston Red Sox
13. Jered Weaver SP – Los Angeles Angels of Anaheim
12. Dustin Pedroia 2B Boston Red Sox
11. Albert Pujols 1B – Los Angeles Angels of Anaheim
10. Prince Fielder 1B Detroit Tigers
9. Ryan Braun LF Milwaukee Brewers
8. Robinson Cano 2B New York Yankees
7. Roy Halladay SP Philadelphia Phillies
6. Jose Bautista RF Toronto Blue Jays
5. Clayton Kershaw SP Los Angeles Dodgers
4. Troy Tulowitzki SS Colorado Rockies
3. Miguel Cabrera 3B Detroit Tigers
2. Justin Verlander SP Detroit Tigers
1. Matt Kemp CF Los Angeles Dodgers

Number 101, to me, is Jay Bruce. What do you think?
This is MLB Network’s list…

LOL that list is a joke

David Wright should be number 101. In fact, he should be top 50.

I guess MLB Network is deluded. There is no possible logical explanation for why Carl Crawford, David Freese, Shin-Soo Cho, Brett Lawrie should make it over David Wright

I’d also like to know how
Rickey Romero > Cole Hamels?
Castro being in the 90s?
Tulo being 4th? He’s good, but not top 5. Streaky and injury prone
… there are too many flaws to point out

Also, where is Josh Johnson and Hanley Ramirez? If this list is suppose to be based of 2011, it’s still delusional since Wainwright is on there.

P Justin Masterson CLE

Andre Either

there is no wrong answer to this question

Jeremy Hellickson… Up and coming and going to be a stud!

It be difficult to determine. Their are a handfull of players who could be placed 101. As well a couple on here that would probably be better of rated 101 than where they are.

After todays events, are the Boston Red Sox the clear-cut favourites in the AL East

  • Well, I aint a Red Sox fan, I am a Mets fan, but believe me, I respect your team and hate the Yankettes.

    Classy team, classy players, the oldest ballpark in the game (I dont like how my Mets got new stadium; I loved Shea , but oh well), classy owners.

    Red Sox are a classy team, and better than Yankers.

    Bosnian proves that he is a retarded stalker.

  • I’ll still take the Rays, but I’d like to think that the Red Sox will still take the second or third best record in the AL.
  • AL East Standings:

    Baltimore 1-0
    Tampa Bay 1-0
    Toronto 1-0
    New York 0-1
    Boston 0-1

    With 161 games left. Pretty funny stuff.

  • No Yankees are still a overall better team then the Red Sox

    @ Nick kid go block people more you moron
    you think Rivera is overrated shouldn’t be such a disrespectful tool

  • Find a experienced and healthy closer first and get a manger who is not as annoying at times as Valentine oh also make sure Lester actually steps up thid year and stays healthy and be the ace you and i know he can be. Other than that maybe
  • The Sox are not the clear cut favorites in the AL East. The Yankees are and opening day won’t change anything. The Red Sox will defineitly be the WC winner, not the division winner.
  • You just continue to make yourself and the Boston Red Sox fanbase look bad.
  • The Red Sox lost too. And they can never over come what happened last year, the red sox.
  • I am a big time Red Sox fan, but I went out on a real big limb and predicted that the Mets will finish with a better record. I still think so.

    But it is fun to relish a Mo meltdown so early in the year. And, if i could call on any closer for a save that my life depended on. it would be Mo.

    Bottom line, No , the Red Sox are still in an awful place this year. Another outlandish prediction-Their streak of sellouts may end. If it doesn’t, it is probably that centennial thing

  • RED SOCKS ALL THE WAY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
  • The Red Sox lost too and it’s only the first game of the season. The Red Sox are a 3rd place team this year.

Would you read these stories

the first one I’m in the middle of writing is about a girl who moves to England after her parents get killed in a car crash. she lives with her uncle who she’s only met a few times. it’s basically about her adjusting to her new life, meeting new people, falling in love, things like that.

the other one is about a young woman who loves baseball (maybe a little obsessed? she has season tickets, the whole nine) and the new York Yankees and her sister sets her up with "the perfect guy". she thinks everything is great until she goes to a game with her best friend, and the guy her sister sets her up with us there. turns out hes a Boston red sox fanatic.

Yes the first one seems interesting and the second one seems like it would be funny haha

They both sound great, but if I had to choose, I’d go with the first one.

Honestly? No. They sound like the usual stuff. Try twistin the plot.. Like in the first story, her uncle is an english terrorist, but she loves him so much she wont do anything about it? or a guy she likes is the by who kille her parents?
Or in the second one, the guy is a boston red sox player or something
Be creative!
“Imagination is better than a pen abd a pencil”- me

New york Yankees or Boston Red sox

I personally am a Yankees fan but what do you guys/girls think?:)

No fighting!

Boston Red Sox. I don’t usually fight with Yankees fans unless they say something that makes absolutely no sense. I actually respect the Yankees and their history. It’s just that some “fans” don’t know what the heck they are talking about.

BOSTON RED SOX!

I’m a Yankees fan. I also go for local New York teams in hockey (Rangers) and basketball (Knicks) even though I think basketball is boring, at least on TV. And I go for one of the two New Jersey football teams that call themselves New York (Jets) but I don’t dislike the other one (Giants). I don’t dislike the Mets either but I do dislike the Islanders and Devils.

Do the Boston Red Sox have top Rotation in the AL East

1. Lester 2. Beckett 3.Clay Buchholz 4. Doubront 5. Bard… i think so

Pineda is a big loss for the Yankee$ as they may have had a competitive rotation but now is riddled with injury.
BQ: Will Phil Hughes $uck again, this year? and another thing – Kuroda #2 starter??! are you kidding me LOL.

No, not even close.

Yeah ok, thumb me down, the Rays easily have the best rotation in the east.

Did you enjoy the Red Sox play-off games last year?

I didn’t think so.

Ha, thanks for the laugh. We all know the Rays have the best rotation in the AL East.
1.Price
2.Shields
3.Hellickson
4.Moore
5.Niemann

BQ:He’ll do better than Bard.

Lol no, not at all….. The Yankees don’t even have an amazing rotation let alone the Sox.
The Tampa Bay Rays have the best rotation in the AL East. All 5 of their pitchers are top-notch.
Sox only have the best lineup. That’s all they really excel at.

As a Red Sox fan, I laugh at your question. We clearly do not have the best rotation. That title belongs to the Rays. We do have the best lineup though.

The Red Sox do have the best rotation.

April Fools.

The 2012 regular season is just around the corner are you excited? BQ

BQ What do you hope to see in the 2012 season?
I expect to see all 30 teams play 162 games of baseball! That is enough really. I also hope to see the Red Sox win it all in 2012!
Rock over Fenway,
Rock on Boston!
Red Sox: 2012 World Series Champions!

Yes Very Excited!!!

BQ: Phillies to win. I go philly style baby!

I’m excited as hell. I hope the Rays make it far this season.

On a side note.. Boston won’t win the 2012 World Series. I’ll bet money on that.

I pumped. This is going to be the longest half week ever. I’m going to miss opening Day though cus I got a baseball tourny.

BQ: My Tigers of course.

You know it!
…Well, I guess you don’t, or you wouldn’t have asked…
BQ: Probably a pipe dream, but I would love it- LOVE IT- if Matt Kemp hit the Triple Crown. AND lead in stolen bases. That would be so cool.

Preseason Power Rankings? BQ

Bleachreport.com released their preseason power rankings for the MLB season. The list goes as follows:

1) Detroit Tigers
2) New York Yankees
3) Texas Rangers
4) Los Angeles Angels of Anaheim
5) Tampa Bay Rays
6) Philadelphia Phillies
7) San Francisco Giants 8) Washington Nationals
9) Milwaukee Brewers
10) Boston Red Sox
11) Miami Marlins
12) St. Louis Cardinals
13) Arizona Diamondbacks
14) Atlanta Braves
15) Cincinnati Reds
16) Toronto Blue Jays
17) Los Angeles Dodgers
18) Kansas City Royals
19) Cleveland Indians
20) Chicago White Sox
21) San Diego Padres
22) Colorado Rockies
23) Pittsburgh Pirates
24) Seattle Mariners
25) New York Mets
26) Chicago Cubs
27) Minnesota Twins
28) Oakland Athletics
29) Baltimore Orioles
30) Houston Astros

Do you agree with these rankings? What are your rankings?

BQ: Which teams of this list will make the postseason?

that sounds right but the Houston Astros already beat the yankees sadly in the first couple of preseason games. and i think the baltimore orioles deserve a better ranking then that they are better then the colorado rockies.

Absolutely not, I don’t agree with these rankings.

Justin Verlander’s peripheral stats remained the same from is 2009-2011 seasons, the only difference being his obscenely lucky BABIP last year. Anyone expecting a repeat is in for a sure disappointment, dont get me wrong, he is still very good, but his ERA and WHIP will regress mightily, back to the 3.30 1.17 range up from his lucky 2.40 ERA and 0.92 WHIP of last year.

After that, taking away Victor Martinez and adding Prince Fielder is worth about 2 wins, take into the fact that Miguel Cabrera playing 3B will likely cost them ~1 win and they’re probably the same team they were last year, if not worse (factoring in Verlander’s expected regression, of course)

Big name signing’s do not equal big time greatness, just ask the Red Sox last season, or the yankees from 2001-2008…

That being said, they have by far the easiest hold on a division in baseball, but to call them the best team in baseball is completely ludacris, I would put them behind the Rangers, Angels, Yankees and Rays.

I think the division winners will be the Angels, Tigers, Yankees, with the Rangers and Rays taking the wild cards in the AL.

Phillies, Brewers, Diamondbacks in the NL, with the Braves/Nationals/Cards taking the 2 spots, no one is very good so its hard to pick one lol.

is it free speech to ware Yankee shirts to Fenway in boston during a Yankee Red Sox Game

My Friend who is also a yankee thinks it is a hostile gesture to ware yankee at Red Sox but no ones going to walk up to you and punch you in the face just out of nowhere, i told my friend it is our right of free speech to ware Yankee at Red Sox but he still wont go with me.

  • Actually is a right of free expression (it goes along with free speech)
  • It is Freedom of Speech, but you may get punched in the face.
  • WEAR what ever you want to WEAR. Regards, Dirty Harry
  • its basically falls into your first amendment rights. you can wear whatever you want. although the redsox fans might not be as understanding as the constitution
  • yeah, go ahead and wear it! which game are planning to attend?
  • It is definitely a form freedom of expression, but don’t be surprised when you hear chants of “Yankees SUCK” bellowing in your ears or if some drunk Bostonian “accidentally” spills his beer all over you.
  • why wouldnt you be allowed to wear a yankee shirt at fenway park? If you like the yankees, wear a yankees shirt!
  • Freedom of expression. If some idiot does come out of nowhere and punches you in the face, you have one hell of a lawsuit.
  • yeah its a sign of free expression but sox fans are going to bully TF out of you guys,theres nothing wrong with supporting your team but your walking on thin ice by doing that in boston
  • Well yes it is

    but why throw gasoline on a fire that shouldn’t be burning

  • You know what, yanks suck! When I went to Yankee Stadium for a Yanks-sox game (Sox won, no surprise), i decked out in all the Sox stuff i had. People were angry, but they cant do sh!t!

By how many games will the Boston Red Sox win the AL East by in 2012 (multiple choice…)

A) 2
B) 5
C) 10
D) 20
Multiple Choice People!! No other answers are accepted! Thanks for your support.

  • I would say B, but D would be nice. hahhaha
  • The answer isn’t there.Because they most likely won’t win the East.@Joseph you don’t what the hell you are talking about.People that regularly use this site know I’m a White Sox fan,and i hate the Yankees and the Red Sox.SO SHUT THE HELL UP WHILE THE GROWN FOLKS ARE TALKING!
  • i think joshua is a new york fan… I would have to say B but if they are able to pull through this year, then C
  • They have to get past the O’s first…
  • Lol @Mad’s answer! They won’t win the AL East, the Rays will win it!! Let’s go Rays!!
  • E) None of the Above….Please Explain Below
    EXPLANATION: They won’t win the division at all

    I actually had multiple choice questions like that on exams I took in college, where E) None of the Above….Please Explain Below was a real choice, and underneath was a spot for EXPLANATION for me to write in an answer.

  • E.) None of the above. The Red Sox will have an 8 game lead or so, then choke near the end. Making the Yankees the AL East Champs.
  • ZERO they won’t win it or get close they stay at 3rd
  • None of the above. They won’t win the AL East.
  • The Red Sox aren’t winning the AL east this year, hate to break it to ya.

    @Coach: No one cares about your predicitions, they are all boneheaded predictions.

  • I’m a sox fan and…they will win wild card but I seriously don’t think they can win the AL east. So if they were to I would have to pick A.
  • Out of those choices…. the best one would be A. I don’t see the Red Sox winning the AL East…. I see them out of the playoffs this year.
  • The real answer is the Yankees by 9 games

    Valentine is okay as a manager but he won’t get them there remember the Mets

  • My answer is e. They aren’t winning the division.
  • E) wild card
  • E) neither of the above

    But, I really think the Rays will win the AL East, and the Red Sox and Jays will be the wild cards.

  • I predicted that the Red Sox will finish the season with a 92-70 record and will win the AL East by 2 games (letter A) for my blog at http://bikinihill.blogspot.com/ if you’re interested in checking it out (I predicted the records of all 30 MLB teams there for this season)…. Enjoy the season!
  • Didn’t know the Red Sox were already guaranteed a playoff spot even before the season starts